“It is necessary…for a man to go away by himself…and ask, ‘Who am I, where have I been, and where am I going?'” – Carl (August) Sandburg (1878-1967), U.S. poet, biographer, journalist and editor.
How to Be Truly Free: Lessons From a Philosopher President
Pepe Mujica, Uruguay’s spartan former president and plain-spoken philosopher, offers wisdom from a rich life as he battles cancer.
Mujica was interviewed by Jack Nicas, New York Times Brazil Bureau Chief. Based in Rio de Janeiro, he leads NYT coverage for much of South America.
Hope, Positive Messages
Nicas: It seems you don’t have much hope.
Biologically, I do have hope, because I believe in man. But when I think about it, I’m pessimistic.
Nicas: Yet your speeches often have a positive message.
Because life is beautiful. With all its ups and downs, I love life. And I’m losing it because it’s my time to leave. What meaning can we give to life? Man, compared to other animals, has the ability to find a purpose.
Or not. If you don’t find it, the market will have you paying bills the rest of your life.
If you find it, you will have something to live for. Those who investigate, those who play music, those who love sports, anything. Something that fills your life.
Being Remembered
Nicas: How would you like to be remembered? .
I have one thing. The magic of the word.
The book is the greatest invention of man. It’s a shame that people read so little. They don’t have time.
Reading on phones, digital world
Nicas: Nowadays people do much of their reading on phones.
Four years ago, I threw mine away. It made me crazy. All day talking nonsense.
We must learn to speak with the person inside us. It was him who saved my life. Since I was alone for many years, that has stayed with me.
When I’m in the field working with the tractor, sometimes I stop to see how a little bird constructs its nest. He was born with the program. He’s already an architect. Nobody taught him. . .
Nicas: Going back to phones: Are you saying they are too much for us?
It’s not the phone’s fault. We’re the ones who are not ready. We make a disastrous use of it.
Children walk around with a university in their pocket. That’s wonderful. However, we have advanced more in technology than in values.
Nicas: Yet the digital world is where so much of life is now lived.
Nothing replaces this. . . This is nontransferable. We’re not only speaking through words. We communicate with gestures, with our skin. Direct communication is irreplaceable.
We are not so robotic. We learned to think, but first we are emotional beings. We believe we decide with our heads. Many times the head finds the arguments to justify the decisions made by the gut. We’re not as aware as we seem.
And that’s fine. That mechanism is what keeps us alive. It’s like the cow that follows what’s green. If there is green, there is food. It’s going to be tough to give up who we are.
‘. . . You’re free when you escape the law of necessity’
Nicas: It seems biology is an important part of your worldview.
I think that humanity, as it’s going, is doomed.
We waste a lot of time uselessly. We can live more peacefully. . .
You’re free when you escape the law of necessity — when you spend the time of your life on what you desire. If your needs multiply, you spend your life covering those needs.
Humans can create infinite needs. The market dominates us, and it robs us of our lives.
Humanity needs to work less, have more free time and be more grounded. Why so much garbage? Why do you have to change your car? Change the refrigerator?
There is only one life and it ends. You have to give meaning to it. Fight for happiness, not just for wealth.
Note: A version of this article appears in print on Aug. 24, 2024, Section A, Page 6 of the New York edition with the headline: Philosopher President, Near His End, on How to Be Truly Free. Order Reprints | Today’s Paper | Subscribe
See more on: José Mujica, who helped lead the transformation of Uruguay, into one of the world’s healthiest and most socially liberal democracies.